Announcer: You're listening to the "We Buy Houses" radio show for street-smart investing
tips, trends, and talk with your host, Rick Otton, property investor and mentor, property
investing made simple.
Rick: Hi, everybody.
And it's Rick Otton.
And welcome once again to the podcast.
And I'll tell you what.
I have a really, really old friend of mine with me today.
We're gonna discuss something really quite dynamic.
Heck, Ivan, we go back...
Ivan: No, no.
You're making us sound really old things, come on.
Rick: What?
Ivan: We're really old friends, but let's not be really old.
Rick: We always were very mature.
We're just educated friends.
We've just known each other as friends.
And we've gotten in touch.
Jesus.
And we go back to when we all had hair.
Ivan: Yeah, I was a lot slower in those days, but that's all right.
Rick: I'll tell you what.
What we're talking about today is...oh, actually, before we start talking about it, let's talk
about what you know about, or what your expertise is because people are going to go, "Who's
Ivan Frangie [SP]?"
Ivan: Yeah, why should I listen to this dude?
Rick: Yeah, that's right because they're probably driving around some foreign country thinking,
"Who is this guy?" Ivan: Let me give you the part in history.
You and I first met when we were part of Allen Peter's sales team.
And we learned a whole bunch of good skills.
I then went on in the insurance business for a number of years, ended up setting up a company
called Westpac.
It was the fastest-growing company of its type in the world.
I was the first sales manager there.
One of my people sold insurance policies [crosstalk 00:01:30].
Rick: Westpac was like a bank, right?
Ivan: Westpac, the bank.
And sorry for those oversees.
Westpac decided they were going to get into the insurance business.
They decided not to buy an insurance company.
They were gonna grow one.
So they recruited exciting young people like me.
And we set up a company that was, as I say, the fastest-growing of its type in the world.
Rick: I always wondered what happened to it.
So when you left Allen, you went off to build an insurance business for the Westpac Bank.
Ivan: I went to work for the corporate man, very exciting.
Rick: They're forward thinking people.
How long did you stay there for?
Ivan: About five years.
And then I decided that the corporate man was not for me.
Rick: I just don't see that, a corporate guy.
Ivan: So about 25 years ago I retired.
And people say, "What do you mean you retired?
Did you have enough money?"
No.
I got people to pay me to do something.
I'd probably do it for free anyway.
And that was Speak and Train.
And so for all the time, I am like you.
I'm fascinated with how people think and how people structure their communication.
So I spent years watching the best, studying the best, observing the best, looking at all
the research reports.
Last year, for example, I was in Washington working with a company called the CEB, who
are the best researchers on what's actually happening in the world of selling.
They've just been bought by Gartner, who are the best people who research marketing.
So I'm fascinated with how this works.
And that's why I thought we should talk about how to structure a conversation so that it
works.
Rick: Well, let me tell you, before we get into that, do you ever find, right, now what
we know is when people chat to you, people you just don't know, you're actually listening
to what they are saying, but you're actually re-writing under those words what, like the
mirror language, right?
They go, "This, this, this, and this," and they go, "Well, one day we should get together
sometime," which means, "Don't call me again, never."
Ivan: Yeah, I want to get out of here, but I don't want to be rude.
Rick: Yeah, I don't want to be rude [inaudible 00:03:14].
Ivan: So I'm just going to say, "We should catch up."
And both of you go, "Yeah, that's cool," which means no.
Rick: Yeah, or basically say, "You're one of the nicest guys I've met, but..."
[Inaudible 00:03:25].
That's funny.
I can't help myself.
I'll listen to a conversation.
And I'm actually rewriting what's really being said under the words.
It's like classic [inaudible 00:03:32], you know, when you're with your partner, right?
You go, "What's wrong?"
And she goes, "Nothing."
Well, is it really nothing or is it seriously something, right?
Ivan: "But there must be something wrong?"
"No, I'm fine."
Rick: Yeah.
And then [inaudible 00:03:42], "If you love me, you'd know."
Ivan: Yeah, I've managed to find a partner that doesn't do guilt as a weapon.
Rick: Oh, man.
Has she got a friend?
Ivan: So I've kind of forgotten about a lot of that stuff.
But it comes back to what we were talking about.
And the problem is these days, and I've really seen this a lot with the millennials coming
up, and this is not a slight on the millennials, not at all.
They're screen babies.
And because a lot of them are screen babies, they tend to use digital communication as
their way of communicating.
So a lot of the face-to-face skills that people actually need when you get eyeball to eyeball,
belly to belly, face to face with somebody that you've actually gotta talk to, the ability
to have a structured commercial conversation has not been lost.
It just hasn't been taught.
Rick: No, I think you're 100% right.
I think it's like when we grew up, right, it was like you'd go out and play hospital
chasings and all those games, all the kids around the street from [inaudible 00:04:38]
Ivan: Hospital chasing.
Rick: Do you remember that?
Ivan: I do, yeah.
Rick: It was like leapfrog, but in those days [inaudible 00:04:44].
So we'd give away [inaudible 00:04:45].
Anyway, let's get back to what we were going to talk about.
Ivan: Yep.
So here's the challenge that I see.
Firstly, I think there are two or three of them.
When you and I were growing up, there were four factories.
The factories were the insurance companies, IBM, Rank Xerox, and basically door-to-door
selling.
And in all of those things, you had to know how to have a conversation with somebody quickly.
Those factories have closed.
I think one of the major problems these days is where do you go to learn the face-to-face
communications?
Because a lot of businesses that used to teach it are no longer there teaching it.
Now, does that mean that the skill doesn't exist?
It just means there are less people teaching it.
And what's happening, what I see a lot more, is people saying, "Well, I'm actually gonna
put this into my digital communication.
So I'm gonna be Facebooking, LinkedIn, Instagram," all of this stuff.
In other words, they're kinda doing more marketing before they get to talk to people, before
they actually have a conversation with people.
Now, there's nothing wrong with that.
It's just that I think the skills of having that commercial conversation where you actually
have a map of how you're gonna speak to people, that's, I think, where it gets lost.
And what I watch is, when I'm out talking to people, because I spend time in the field
following people around, watching what they do.
And one of the big things they do is what I call bucketing.
So if somebody says something and they move straight from, "You've got a problem.
I've got a solution.
Let me bridge that gap.
So you've mentioned your problem.
I'm gonna tell you the solution," instead of investigating what the problem is and seeing
whether you agree with their version of the problem.
Rick: Yeah, before you come in with a solution, right?
Yeah, otherwise, people won't buy into the solution.
If they don't believe it in their mind is a solution to their problem.
Ivan: Yeah.
And let me give you one thing just for the...because we wanna be practical here.
One of the greatest things that I have happen to me on a daily basis, I talk to people who
are clients of mine.
They want to know how to sell more.
I say to them, "Where do you reckon the issue is with your selling?"
And they say, "I need to know how to close a sale more."
And my challenge with that is a lot of the reason they're not closing the sale...I hate
that as a language because I don't think you actually close anything.
I think you just get in agreement and move on, another subject.
One of the challenges is they haven't opened it properly.
People are not sure where they're going.
So I talk to my clients about a pathway to purchase, rather than a sales process.
You wanna understand how the client buys.
Once you understand how the client buys, you can create the pathway to purchase.
The challenge is we're trying to fit them into a sales process where they've actually
got a buying process.
And the issue with that is that in 1927, a guy named J.T. King [SP] came up with a lot
of the technology we're using now in our conversations.
He came up with close the sale, handle objections, you know, manage how you...
Rick: All that stuff.
Ivan: All of that stuff.
And the problem is majority of sales people these days are still using that.
Now, that's 90 years old.
The clients are buying 2017 methods.
So you and I are buying in a 2017 mode where we've got more information we've ever had
before.
We know more about the product than ever before.
I tell you, I said I was in with CEB last year in Washington.
They've got an interesting statistic.
They're saying that most people now are over half-way through a buying decisions by the
time they call in an expert.
Now, they say 57%.
So by the time you and I bother to call in somebody to get their opinion or to talk to
them, we're over half-way through our decision to buy.
Now, the problem with that is 10 years ago, even five years ago, we didn't have that number
because Google, social media, all that sort of stuff, we go on and we get an opinion from
someone else.
So a lot of sales people have got to recover from the fact that the client is way more
advanced than they are.
Why?
Because they're still using 1990 selling methods, 1927 selling methods, to sell to somebody
who's buying in a 2017 way.
Does that kind of make sense?
Rick: Well, not only that does it make a lot of sense, but something that really struck
home earlier in your conversation, which is, and you see this all the time on social media,
is everybody from behind the screen builds their whole marketing machine, their whole
marketing funnel, but you watch.
Once they hit that confrontational, that connection with people, on a live as you said belly-to-belly,
it's like, "Oh, my God.
Where do I go from here," right?
That's the bit that's missing now because as you said, they don't teach this.
There's a craft that was taught years ago.
Ivan: And that's the bit I specialize in.
I specialize in, when you actually get to talk to someone, how do you do that?
So let's give a couple of practical examples.
Practical example one.
If you wanna close the sale...I don't like the language but everybody use this, so we're
just keeping palate...you've gotta open well.
And if you want to set a pathway to purchase, if you want to set someone, "This is where
we're going.
This is what's gonna happen here," a framework of...And actually, when I'm out with my clients
and I teach them how to set an agenda for a conversation, their clients physically relax.
You can actually see it in their body language.
So what does an agenda mean?
So you and I do this naturally because we've been taught to.
And it is at the beginning, tell people what's gonna happen, what's the process, how long
is it gonna take, how are you gonna do it?
And at the end, this is what's gonna take place.
So a simple one would be so Rick, thanks very much for taking some time to spend, you know,
with me today.
Here's what I'd love to do.
I'd like to by the end of our conversation, I'm gonna let you know whether or if I can
help you.
If I can help you, great.
I'll tell you that.
If I can't, I'll give you the resources or put you in touch with the people that would
be able to help you.
Now how I do this is I'm gonna ask you some questions.
I'll probably take some notes.
Is that okay?
Rick: Yeah.
Ivan: Okay.
And generally this will take whatever the time frame is, but generally this is kind
of 15 to 20 minutes of conversation, unless you've got some questions.
And at the end of that time, we'll know what to do next.
Does that sound okay?
Rick: Yeah.
Ivan: Right.
Now what have we actually just done?
Rick: Well, we just created the framework about what's gonna happen.
One of the things it's done is taking the anxiety out of the room because you don't
have someone sitting there going, "Oh, gee, what's gonna happen next?
What's gonna happen next?
What's gonna happen next?"
Ivan: Yeah, where are we going?
Rick: Where are we going?
Where is this all gonna end up, right?
It's kind of like, "Well, we know."
Ivan: It's kind of like going to the airport without an itinerary.
And that's what I see a lot of people do.
They go to the airport.
And they kind of go, "Give me a ticket, give me a ticket."
Where to?
"Oh, it doesn't matter.
I got opportunities everywhere."
As opposed to, "I know where I'm going.
I know where the flight lands.
I know what's gonna happen when I get off at the other end."
And so people relax.
And physically, you can actually see them relax.
So this is part of what I call behavior metrics.
So behavior metrics is, there are certain behaviors that if you do them will end up
with you getting into a better position in your conversation.
The difference is this conversation has structure.
That's pretty much as simple as it is.
Why a metric?
Because if I know what your industry is, what I've done is to create a whole lot of behavior
metric programs.
In other words, the average sales guy, most industries, has about 20 to 24 behaviors they
have to do in an interview to make sure they end up where they need to be so the client's
happy and they're happy.
That varies, depending on the industry.
What I can do...I'm sorry, what I've got my clients doing, would be a better thing...is
to actually give them the behavior maps.
Now, setting an agenda is a behavior map because there are certain things.
Tell the client, "This is what we're gonna be doing at the end.
I'll let you know whether I can help you or not."
I'm gonna get permission to ask questions.
I'm gonna get permission to take notes.
I'm gonna tell you roughly how long it's gonna take.
And I'm gonna ask you whether or not that's okay with you and if you have anything else
you wanna add to that?
Six behaviors in that short little space.
Now, here's the good news.
If I know what your behavior map is, I can just go out and go, "Well, I can tick them
off.
You either did the behavior or you didn't."
And the great news for that is that means if you know what your behavior map is, you
can just tick whether you did them or not.
And you know exactly where you're doing well and where you're not as opposed to, "This
guy's got a great attitude."
Well, attitudes are terrific, but I can't measure management in attitude.
What I do know is that people who've got great attitudes behave differently.
I'm more interested in how do they behave so they ended up creating something as an
outcome?
Does that kind of make sense?
Rick: Yeah.
Let's think this through.
We all need somebody...
Ivan: I'm sorry.
That's my tea for the drink...I'm drinking a cup of tea because we're doing a podcast,
so I've got a cup of tea, that's the slurp you can hear.
Rick: No, that's okay.
I've had 19 coffees.
Ivan: You can hear the slurp and the gurgle on the tape.
Okay.
Rick: Okay.
So here we go.
Let's relate this say to property.
And you're gonna see some guy who says he wants to sell a property.
Now, your brain would, therefore, go, "Okay.
Then I want to get this bit, this bit, this bit, this bit, this bit."
What might be the elements or the components?
So you're thinking a guy says to you he wants to sell property.
You don't wanna back out on him.
So what might be the big picture?
If people want to sort of go, "Oh, I've got to cover this bit, this bit, this bit, this
bit, this bit," what would those bits be?
Ivan: Okay.
There are some blocks...
Rick: Yeah, the blocks.
Ivan: ...that you've got tos do.
So the first thing is you've got to set the agenda, like we just did.
And your agenda in property would be something like, "Rick, thanks very much for taking the
time to have a chat to me about potentially buying your property.
I don't know if I can help you.
What I'd like to do is I'd like to ask you some questions about, you know, just what
your situation is.
I'd like to discover why you're, you know, talking to somebody like me right now.
I'm probably going to take some notes.
Generally, this takes, oh, I don't know 15 minutes to 20-25 minutes, depending on what
kind of questions you've got.
And at the end of it, I'll let you know whether I can help you or not.
If I can help you, I'll tell you.
If I can't, I'll put you in touch with some resources or some people or things that might
be able to give you a hand."
Rick: Okay.
So the guy's gonna go, "That's great.
Fantastic."
What kind of questions are you gonna start out asking?
Ivan: Well, let's just stop there for a minute because one of the reasons that I want people
to do that is because it stops them coming in and going...They hear the question or they
hear the, "I want to sell my property."
And so typically, students, and we've watched them do it, who are incredibly enthusiastic
[inaudible 00:15:10] with Rick's, you know, great strategies.
And what they wanna do is show people how bright they are.
So they go "You wanna sell your property?
Let me give you the three or four ways that we can do that.
We can do a lease bit.
We can do [inaudible 00:15:20] or we can do an option," all that stuff.
And the clients go, "I have no idea what you're talking about.
I don't even know whether you're relevant to me."
So one of the reasons for setting an agenda is to stop bucketing because what you've actually
done right up front is to say, "I bet you're gonna ask me questions before we go any further."
Does that [inaudible 00:15:37]?
Rick: Yeah.
And once you set the agenda, it lets you know in your own mind where everything fits.
I think when people start, "Well, what about that," you go, "Well, that's a really great
question," or, "What I might do is address that a little bit later based on what we're
gonna be doing here today."
Ivan: Yeah.
And so one of the first questions would be get them to tell you what their situation
is.
So the question for that isn't, "Okay.
So why do you wanna sell your house?"
That's a crap question.
That's a crap question because they wanna sell their house because they've got a problem.
I get that.
"I want to sell the house because I need the money."
Well, yeah, but you and I both know that that's not really gonna motivate somebody to do business
with you.
That's their underlying reason factually, but it's not their underlying motivation,
is it?
[Inaudible 00:16:23]?
Rick: So what do you think would be a better question?
Ivan: A better question would be...I go into places all the time where I'm taking to people.
It's how you set up your credibility.
I go into places all the time where I'm talking to people about potentially buying their homes
and solving an issue they've got.
I'm an expert on buying homes and solving problems.
What I'm not an expert on is you.
Could you tell me a little bit about just why I'm here and why you're talking to me,
what you like me?
And just leave it open, just leave it open.
Let me give you an example of how this works.
I went in to buy a TV recently.
How many TVs do you reckon there are in most Harvey Norman Bingley's or whatever.
How many TVs [inaudible 00:17:05]?
Rick: There must be 20 or 30.
They're all over the place.
Ivan: Thirty or 40 TVs.
And they're different sizes.
And they've all got different styles and brands.
Are you an expert on TV?
Rick: Absolutely not.
Ivan: Okay.
So if you went in to look at it, you'd look at them all.
And you'd see all the slides on them and say, you know, HD, 4G, whatever [crosstalk 00:17:22].
Rick: [Inaudible 00:17:23] and all that stuff.
Ivan: Well, I don't get it.
So we need the one at Domayne in Alexandria.
And I was actually walking around.
Anyway, I go into the guy and he was brilliant.
And he said, "Look.
Before we go anywhere near a TV, I'm an expert on TVs, but I'm not an expert on you.
So can I just ask you some questions so that I can figure out which TV to recommend because
I got lots of TVs here?
My job is to figure out which one's the best for you.
So do you mind if I just ask you some questions about how you watch TV and what kind of TV
you want.
And then at the end of that, I'll make a recommendation."
And I went, "That's fantastic because I'm confused by all this."
And his questions were good like, you know, "So tell me what kind of TV do you watch?"
I watch movies.
So he narrowed it down.
He said, "Do you watch any sport?"
Yeah.
"Well, what kind of sport do you watch?"
And I said to him, "Why does that make a difference?"
He said, "Well, there's a refresh rate on the screen.
So if you're watching something like tennis with a fast-moving, small ball, you have to
have the refresh rate, in other words the number of times that TV gets a new picture,
it has to be quick because otherwise, the ball will be in one place, then it will be
in another place.
You don't know how it got there."
He said, "But if you're watching things like rugby, it's not gonna be such a big deal because,
you know, people are moving instead of balls moving," and that sorta stuff.
I said, "Oh, that makes sense.
I watch a lot of tennis.
I love tennis.
I play tennis."
He said "Oh, great.
How close do you sit to the screen?
Do you listen to music?
Do you listen to movies, you know?"
And so he asked me all these questions.
And at the end of it he said, "Well, after what you told me, I'd recommend these four
TVs."
Now, he hasn't talked to me about what yet because what's the big question you reckon
you get when you go in to buy a TV?
The big two questions?
Rick: Can I help you?
Ivan: Yeah, can I help you Rick: What are you looking for?
Ivan: What are you looking for?
And the third question is?
Rick: How much you're gonna spend?
Ivan: How much you've got to spend?
Now, here's the problem with how much you've got to spend?
Rick: I hate that question.
Ivan: Yeah, but what do you reckon most people are gonna do?
Rick: Well, they're gonna say a lot lower figure than what they've got to spend.
Ivan: Yeah, of course.
Rick: [Inaudible 00:19:30] out their wallet, this guy's gonna spend whatever they got.
Say, "Now then, tell me what you got."
Ivan: I'm not gonna tell you the truth because you're a sales person.
As you're fond of saying, "Sales, sales person, Liar, liar pants on fire."
Rick: Pants on fire, right?
So then they're gonna go, "Oh, man.
I'm gonna show this guy the top TV we've got."
Everybody hates that idea.
So they're gonna go, "Well, not much actually."
Ivan: So this guy was really good.
So he said, "I've got four TVs here.
They all vary in price.
And the price isn't important yet.
Now what you have to do is have a look at those four and tell me which one you think
looks the best for your eyes."
Rick: Oh, I like that question.
Ivan: And I went, "Oh, okay."
So now I'm fascinated about which TV I like the best, not which one I'm gonna pay for.
Eventually, I said to him, "I like that one best."
He said, "Ah, that's a good choice.
That's not the most expensive one here.
It's also not the cheapest one here, but that's pretty good.
He said, "But if your eyes like it, that's the best one for you because it meets all
the other criteria about the refresh rate, the sounds..."
Rick: [Inaudible 00:20:26] and all that extra stuff, right?
And he's already asked you that.
Ivan: He's already asked me that.
Rick: Now, here's the interesting part about it.
You're more likely to buy into that solution because you believe he's asked the questions
to have a full understanding of what your problem was.
Ivan: Well, whose solution is it?
Rick: It's yours.
You create your own solution.
Ivan: Who can object to that?
Rick: Y ou can't.
And actually, you can't go, "I wanna think about it."
You can't actually make the decision you're making about your own TV and say, "Well, I
want that TV but I want to think about whether I want that TV."
It doesn't make any sense because he didn't tell you what to buy.
You told him which one you want to buy.
Ivan: And one of the great things about doing this is make sure that you flip the sale.
So instead of you selling, why don't you get people to buy?
So instead of being a sales person, become an assistant buyer.
So this guy effectively put his arm around me, around my shoulder, stood with me looking
at all the TVs.
And went, "That's bloody confusing, isn't it?
You know, God, that would be really hard.
So if I can understand you, I can walk you through this confusion."
So if we go back to property, if I understand what your circumstances are and what you're
trying to achieve and, you know, if you tell me, you know, kind of how you got here and
what the circumstances are, what I can do is to walk you through the opportunities that
might be available to solve your problem of selling your house.
Rick: Yeah.
And the classic is you walk in and people they go, "Well, pardon me, you know, the market's
moving down.
I can't make payments on this house.
I'm trying to get away from this relationship or I've got debt or credit cards.
And I have all this mess."
It's usually not just a house.
It's all the other mess and associated components that come with it.
Ivan: Exactly right, but it's their mess.
And you can't solve their mess, excuse me, until you understand...I drank the tea too
fast...until you understand their situation and they're buying into it.
So that's why flipping the sale and becoming an assistant buyer instead of being a sales
person is so important, but here's the other big statistic that came out of Washington
last year.
What they said was that the average sales person is not as equipped to sell as the customer
is to buy.
Now, what that means is they said that the ability of the sales person to actually have
the skill to match the skill of the buyer is about half the skill of the buyer.
Now, there's a whole bunch of statistics behind that, but it basically meant we're selling
in a way that's still 1990's.
The customer is buying in 2017.
We're not as good as they are.
Unless you flip the sale over and go, "Well, how do you buy this?"
Like when you're looking at this, Rick, how are you gonna make a decision as to how you're
gonna, you know, solve the problem with the house?
Well, I have to do this and that and that and this and that.
Well, they're giving you their criteria, as opposed to, "This is what I [crosstalk 00:23:15].
Rick: You know, there's something you said, is really learning property strategies is
not the answer.
You know, sometimes we run around, we go around and say, "Oh, I learned this new strategy,
I learned this new strategy," but really, strategies don't work if the whole situation
or the seller or the buyer or whatever doesn't want to plug into what you got.
Ivan: Well, you also know which strategy to use.
You can't figure out which strategy to use until you've worked out what the real problem
is and what the potential seller has that you can help with.
Now, eventually, we all know that most people have one or two favorite strategies, one or
two.
And they will fit their strategy.
Rick: Pretty much.
Ivan: They'll fit what they're doing around that strategy to help the person who's got
a problem.
We all know that.
And then it comes back to, how can I frame this up?
How can I create a framework for the potential seller that makes him feel comfortable that
what we're doing is actually good for them?
And we've also got to make a decision that's good for us because in a lot of cases, and
you and I have seen this, in a lot of cases, people go in with the...we've all seen deals
where the person's outcome was, "I wanna make a sale here.
In other words, I wanna buy this property."
And then they've walked out and go, "Oh, that actually wasn't such a good one to buy."
Rick: Okay.
Let me ask you.
We've been chatting here now.
We're already up to about 25 minutes.
So we're running out of time on the podcast.
Let's knock this down, right?
So here we go.
Okay.
Great.
Give me something I can walk away with in the next minute or two.
What would it be?
Ivan: Okay.
Firstly, set the agenda at the beginning.
Make sure that you tell people what the pathway to purchase will be, pathway to purchase if
you're selling or the pathway to helping them, if you're in the process of buying their property.
So the second thing is ask good, broad, open questions.
It's not whether it's an open question or a closed question.
It's the intention of the question.
What are you trying to find out?
That's more important than whether it's an open question or a closed question.
There's nothing wrong with closed questions, providing they're appropriate.
The third thing is when you get to the end of what you're doing or the discussion, make
sure you ask a question something like, "Well, why is this important to you?
What's the effect of all of this issue on you?
What's the impact that it's having," because everybody will give you their cosmetic stuff,
which is, "Oh, yeah.
I wanna sell the house."
Why?
"I've got a problem and need some money."
You could have spoken to me.
You could have gone down to the real estate agent.
Why think of somebody like me here?
Rick: Yeah, why did you call me in?
Ivan: Yeah.
And let them tell you, why me, why now, is a pair of really good questions.
Why have you done this now?
And why have you asked me to check you?
And let them sell you on why you're the best person or credible, rather than you telling
them.
Is that feasible?
Rick: Oh, absolutely.
Ivan: And at the end of it, make sure you go to the next step because the next step
may not be a sale or a purchase.
The next step will be whatever the next step in the process is.
Rick: Guys, if you've got any questions, look, support@rickotton.com, support@rickotton.com,
if you've got questions.
I'd love to see you on the next podcast.
I'm going to give this to Ivan Frangie.
In fact, we're gonna do this a second time.
All right guys.
I look forward to [inaudible 00:26:28] you all.
Catch you all later.
Bye.
Announcer: If you would like to download the audio or transcript for this episode, go to
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And if you have any questions, please email support@webuyhouses.com.au.
Thank for tuning in.
You are on the right path to real estate success.
This show does not provide legal, financial, accounting, investment, or any other professional
advice.
Any information shared on this podcast is that of the host.
Nevertheless, Rick and his students are abundantly successful.
I would not transact real estate in any other way.
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